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BvS
#1
Hi all! Has anyone seen Batman v Superman? If so, any initial thoughts or review you might wanna share?
#2
Huh. Was just talking about this in chat.

First off, I was not a fan of their version of Lex Luthor or Batman. At times the movie felt like it was dragging on. The run time would have been reduced by half an hour if they havled the amount of slow motion they used. 

But, the picture, score, and acting were wonderfully done. I actually felt emotions for the end of it (don't wanna spoil).
Stumbling through the adventures of life with a smile.

Smile
#3
I have to say I really hated it. I'm okay with a tortured, angsty take on Superman (I mostly liked Man of Steel.), but in this depiction he seemed to have almost no redeeming qualities. In fact, the movie offered very little to distinguish Superman and Batman as characters other than that they don't like each other, and no real reason to root for one or the other, which is a disaster for a movie with VERSUS right in the title. And as for that element, I found the plot contortions required to make that fight happen ridiculously tedious. Eisenberg's Luthor is one of the worst comic book movie villains I've ever seen; he's aggressively irritating and his plans don't really follow any logic other than the demands of the studio trying to build a cinematic universe. He has no history with either Superman or Batman, so there's really nothing behind his vendetta except that the title of the movie promises they will fight and it's his job to make that happen. And I have to assume loyalty to the studio is also the reason why he's been tracking meta-humans and compiling teaser videos for their spinoff movies.
#4
Team Wonder Woman
#5
Wonder Woman and Alfred were the only remotely redeeming things about this movie. I don't think I've ever seen someone so fundamentally misunderstand the point of a superhero movie as Zack Snyder. If you don't like Superman (which it's now pretty clear that he doesn't) then don't make a Superman movie.

Batman v. Superman Review: Zack Snyder’s Doomsday
10 Questions Batman v. Superman Left Me Asking
Superman and the Damage Done
#6
well the movie was ok, it wasn't jaw dropping but it also wasn't shit. personally it felt kinda rushed. i couldn't get attached to Lex because he didn't have enough time to develop, but from what i saw i loved him. I don't even know what batman was doing half the time, that story was kinda loosely thrown together. i definitely think it was a good set up movie for justice league and that you should watch it, but you probably wouldn't watch it twice. oh also the fight between batman and superman was SSSSOOOOOO forced. it wasn't that great of a fight.
#7
The reason for fighting made no sense; the reason they stopped fighting made even less sense.
#8
I had a lot of issues with it that I really don't want to get into because it would just become a long rant. I did love Wonder Woman though. She stole every scene she was in. Team Wonder Woman!
Trekboy008 likes this post
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#9
Some fandom thing I thought was funny, but apparently a big number of the films' defenders are accusing critics of being paid by Marvel/Disney to give the film a bad review as part of some conspiracy to eliminate MCU competition. Its almost as silly as the 'Marvel is ruining X-Men comics to stop Fox's films' in how insane it is, but yeah, this is a thing people seriously think is happening.
Still not watched the film myself though, will probably see it next week depending on how busy my brother is. Going in completely neutral though; I'm equally prepared to love it or hate it.
#10
Okay I still hate the movie but I'm officially in love with Henry Cavill after watching this video: Batman v Superman Interviews: Versus Everything
#11
OK, so, mild bump but I finally watched it. Big-ass post following.

Overall? Well, it wasn't *terrible*, but it wasn't *great* either. It was, just a movie I guess.
I liked a lot of the action, the casting was mostly good (save for Lex), and there's some ideas I liked; I actually like Caville's Superman though I think he could've done with more depth (the whole 'he wants to help people but when he helps one person other people he could've helped die' conflict I actually quite like since its not something touched upon in recent films but is a big theme in the comics), I like how the Senator lady doesn't like Superman but isn't depicted as two-dimensional and evil for it, and I liked that for once, when Batman and Superman are depicted fighting, Superman's the *good guy* in the conflict, rather than him being corrupted/brainwashed/driven insane/etc to justify Batman taking him down. Afleck did well as Batman but I do wish they toned down the violence with him; the 'he doesn't directly kill them' thing doesn't justify all the explosions (though I didn't have a problem with him killing KGBeast given he killed him in the comics). Also, of course, *loved* Wonder Woman when she was in action and I liked Alfred and Perry.
Show ContentSpoiler:


On the other hand, the flashforward sequence was too long and was pretty jarring; it could've been cut up into a montage and had the intended effect of justifying Batman's fear of Superman, while a lot of the dream sequences felt kinda awkward and the forced Justice League cameos were, well, forced. They could've done with taking them out and instead including a flashback or something to show Batman *before* his recent violent turn, given they say he's 'changed' but don't give us any indication as to what he was like before (maybe show how Robin died; that would explain why he's not pulling punches any more).
Lex, I'm mixed on, since I think I get what they were trying to go for in making him a more Silver Age-style villain, but it largely feels like they could've just settled on going for the more traditional post-Crsis Lex; make him a smug, sociopathic businessman who's able to hide his dark intentions rather than the goofy 'young genius' thing they were going for. The whole 'possibly a servant of Darkseid' thing also feels like it goes against his character; he hates aliens and want to protect the world from Superman, so why would he work for another, actually harmful alien?
It also felt like Superman and Lex didn't really have any connection beyond Lex hating him. Since Superman basically spends the first half of the film by himself, wondering/angsting on his inability to be there for everyone, only occasionally interacting with Lois, Perry, or his mom, he doesn't really have any real interaction with Lex.
Also, I think they really should have worked on the whole 'Batman v Superman' thing. Like, Batman not liking Superman I kinda get; as far as he knows, Superman is a member of the same race that tried to kill everyone and he doesn't know anything about him beyond that, and the fact his fight with Zod-which he only saw bits of-killed a lot of people right in front of Bruce, many of whom worked for him. Combined with his vision of the future, I get Batman not liking Superman and thinking he's a threat. Superman though, I think they should've done more to show why he dislikes Batman; beyond seeing Batman as a violent bully targeting the poor, he doesn't get any other reason to dislike him.
This might have been helped if they bumped into each other while dealing with the same crisis. Like, if Superman got involved in actually combatting Lex's conspiracy and they had the whole 'working the same case' thing, and the two's conflicting style made them bump heads, it would've justified the animosity; then, have the flash-forward sequence showing Batman what will happen if he doesn't stop Superman, and problem solved.
Likewise, they get past their issues a bit too quickly. After the fight when they have the whole 'Martha' thing, if they just included a line or two from Bruce questioning what he's become, expanded a bit on the moment of them talking (maybe have Clark actually explain to Bruce how he has human parents, so the whole 'he's not such an alien after all' thing made more sense), and had more of them working together after that, it would've came off better.
It would've also helped if we got more of the two interacting with each other's supporting cast, like if they didn't cut out Barbara Gordon and instead had her explain Batman's deal to Superman, and had Batman interact with Lois more, then them getting over their hate-on for one-another would've made more sense.
I also think Wonder Woman should have gotten a bigger role in the first half, beyond one-or-two scenes of her interacting with Bruce; maybe have Clark talk to her while they're at Lex's party (if she's a big-shot philanthropist like she seems to be, than it'd make sense for him to talk to her), show her side of the story, and basically give her a role equal to that of the boys, it'd feel less like she's just coming out of nowhere at the end. Still, Gadot did really well in the role and she felt like a badass during the Doomsday fight.
Speaking of, good-GOD was Bruce less than useless in that fight. Literally all he did was run away and dodge Doomsday's attacks (and not even successfully) and toss a Kyrptonite gas grenade at him, while Clark and Diana did the hard work. If they had him retrieve the spear rather than Lois (and thus, had a moment where Superman saves Batman, so Batman's guilt for hi death has more weight), and maybe showed him actually trying to fight Doomsday (like, in the sequences where Doomsday's chasing him, have him throw grenades and explosives at him, have him leap over Doomsday and attack his back, have him trip him up with wires, crash the fucking Batmobile into his fucking face, something), it would've felt less like he was just there, but instead, Batman just looked completely out of his depth.
Seriously, fuck everyone who makes jokes about Hawkeye being the lamest of the Avengers; even in the films he at least does something in the fights, he was even the one to take Loki out of the fight and he did a lot in fighting the Ultrons, not to mention shook Wanda out of her funk (and was the only one standing in the fight on the ship). In comparison to Batman here, Film!Hawkeye is a BAMF (while comic!Hawkeye, who's already a BAMF anyway, can just roll around laughing at Batman's lameness); anyone who's ever made fun of Hawkeye while praising Batman as a badass needs to think real hard about that.

Overall, it wasn't terrible, but they really didn't hit the mark. Combined with the recent lameness of Arrow and Flash since they came back from the winter break, I'm real bummed about the quality of DC's live action properties.

Maybe Suicide Squad or Wonder Woman will be good; in any case, have to agree, fire Zack Snyder because he's just not right for this universe.


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